Bob Rae, on his last day at the UN, says: ‘I think I helped make a difference’

When Bob Rae took office as Canada’s ambassador to the United Nations in 2020, much of the world was still in lockdown due to the global pandemic.

This would be just the first in a series of world-changing events that will unfold during his tenure – including the Taliban takeover of Afghanistan, the Russian invasion of Ukraine, Hamas attacks on Israel, and Israel’s subsequent siege and bombardment of Gaza.

During this time, the organization has been criticized, notably by US President Donald Trump, for its failure to maintain peace.

Rae has his own complaints about the United Nationsbut ultimately, he says he believes in his people and their mission. On his very last day of work, he spoke to As it happensNil KÖksal’s host. The following is an excerpt from that conversation.

You’ve filled a few offices and left different roles. How does this one feel?

It’s been a really mixed experience, and my feelings are rather nostalgic for the number of friendships and personal relationships I’ve made over the course of our mission with the people I work with in Ottawa, with all my colleagues, and with UN officials. I had the chance to say goodbye to a lot of people and it was difficult.

The Economist used the phrase “a bleak future”” to describe what things look like at the UN at a time when Donald Trump is once again in the White House. Do you agree with this characterization that the future of the UN is bleak?

I think it is important to recognize that even in the most difficult circumstances, the UN, its agencies and the people working on the ground for the UN are capable and willing to do extraordinary things.

We see this all the time. We see it in Gaza. We see it in Sudan. We see it on the ground. I think people greatly underestimate the fact that thousands and thousands of people are doing everything they can to make the world a better and safer place, even if everything is going in another direction.

Frankly, we don’t have the luxury of saying, “My God, isn’t that horrible?” Our job is to try to make things better. This is what we do.

Are there one or more moments that will impact you more than others?

The collapse of Afghanistanwhich has so terribly affected the world and all of us, especially the Afghan people. The Taliban takeover there. We immediately took action here in New York. I mean, New York was one of the hubs that was really trying to help people, and we did everything we could to help people get out and respond and make our system work better to help it respond.

The night of Russia’s invasion of Ukraine It was absolutely food for thought. [and] dramatic. Once again we tried to mobilize world public opinion against what the Russians had done, were doing and are doing today.

I remember waking up in the morning to the news of Hamas attack on October 7. And my wife and I, Arlene, were just shaking our heads and saying it was going to be horrible. Because Israel’s reaction This was what I think a lot of people predicted.

Those Events have, of course, dominated the work I have done and many of the things I have had to deal with.

I wonder how you, as you leave, compartmentalize these things or try to put them out of your head. Can you? Or do they always keep you up at night?

No, you can’t. I think you find a coping mechanism, but I don’t think you can ever get it out of your head.

One thing I had to realize… is that you can’t let the deep tragedy of the situation stop you from collecting your thoughts and trying to figure out: Well, what can we do? How can we manage this?

Do you find yourself toughening up to do it? Never. Does this affect you emotionally? Absolutely. And I think that the Canadians who have seen me sometimes wipe away a tear Since my eye or anyone who has difficulty finishing a sentence will know that it has an impact. Of course yes.

WATCH | Bob Rae says the UN must change:

Bob Rae says UN critics are right – and wrong

Outgoing Canadian Ambassador Bob Rae tells CBC News chief correspondent Adrienne Arsenault what critics have right and wrong about the United Nations – and what needs to change for the 80-year-old international organization to remain effective today.

Another notable moment you were there for was in September when Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu speaks at the UN and criticized countries, including Canada, for recognizing the State of Palestine. And as you know, dozens of diplomats have left the country. You remained seated. Why did you make this decision?

Because I thought it was important for Canada to be present in the room and it was up to us to listen to what he was saying. I strongly disagree with much of what he said, but I thought that simply joining a walkout was not the way forward for Canada.

In fact, I made it a point at the UN to sit and listen to many of the speeches. At the very beginning, I wanted to listen to… the President [Mahmoud] Abbas of the Palestinian Authority and Prime Minister Netanyahu, who both spoke. And I made it a point to just say, I’m going to sit here and listen and take notes and really try to understand the language and the arguments that they’re making, and how it can move in a different direction. And I still believe that this is something that needs to be done.

WATCH | Netanyahu’s UN speech incites walkout:

Netanyahu calls decision to recognize Palestine ‘shameful’ after dozens withdraw from UN speech

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu told fellow world leaders at the UN that his country “must finish the job” against Hamas in Gaza and called recognition of the state of Palestine a “shameful decision”. He spoke after dozens of delegates from several countries left the UN hall en masse.

In diplomacy, there are many things that are difficult, I’m sure. But for someone who earned…the nickname “Hurricane Bob,” what was that like?

I think we need to understand the fact that there are still far too many voices in the world who think that Israel has no right to exist as a country in the Middle East. And that’s not my position. This is not Canada’s position.

I did everything I could to encourage the Government of Canada to recognize the State of Palestine. And many in the Jewish community strongly objected to that and said, “How can you do this after what happened on October 7?”

I said, look, there is no way we can resolve the conflict in the Middle East until we recognize the fundamental point that there is dignity in difference, and that Palestine’s difference must be recognized with dignity, and Israel’s difference must be recognized with dignity. And I think that’s a position that I’m proud to maintain, even though, frankly, I’ve received tons of hate mail and all sorts of other forms of communication.

We must find ways to reach a compromise between two countries that need to live together in peace and dignity. We are far from it. But you have to work to try to get there.

Of all the roles and jobs you’ve held, what has this one taught you about yourself, Ambassador?

It was a sort of culmination or perhaps the closing of a circle. As you know, my father did this job 50 years ago, and it took a lot of work at a difficult time in the life of the world.

I’ve learned that I’m actually a better listener than I think, some people think. I learned to get along with a lot of people. And I think I helped make a difference.